Lincoln’s screenplay reverses the adage of “show don’t tell,” leaving us a show that doesn’t tell us much at all.

Genre: Historical
Premise: (from IMDB) As the Civil War continues to rage, America’s president struggles with continuing carnage on the battlefield and as he fights with many inside his own cabinet on the decision to emancipate the slaves.
About: Lincoln was written by Tony Kushner, whose play “Angels in America: A Gay Fantasia on National Themes” earned him a Pulitzer Prize. His last feature credit before this was 2005’s “Munich.”
Writer: Tony Kushner (based in part on a book by Doris Kearns Goodwin)
Details: Dec 20th, 2011 draft (shooting script)

lincoln-poster_743x1100

I don’t want to offend any Lincoln lovers here. I assume this movie is kind of like their baby.  There’s none of that ridiculous goosed-up Hollywood bullshit with splosions or vampires or anything else that might be mistaken for “entertainment.” Entertainment is not the name of the game when Spielberg does serious. One need only watch the trailer to see that. Period Piece men in wigs talking in rooms about things like Amendments and Bills for two hours. THAT’S what you’re getting here. Again, if I’m a Lincoln-era history buff, this is nirvana. But if I’m a moviegoer? This sounds like hell. I shall now put on my script-pray boots and hope that I’m wrong.

It’s January 1865. Two months have passed since Lincoln’s re-election. The American Civil War is in its 4th year. This is actually one of the few things the script did well – let us know where we were in history. This is critical when you’re writing a period piece because the mood of the world (or a nation) in one era can be completely different from the mood in another. The overall tone is going to be different if we’re following, say, Rome at its peak, than if we we’re following Europe after the Black Plague. So it’s a smart move to start your story by putting everything into context for us.

Lincoln starts with a scene that’s pretty indicative of the entire screenplay. CHARACTERS TALKING. Two black soldiers are chatting with Lincoln about the war. They’re noting how white soldiers have better guns and provisions than them.  Lincoln looks sort of troubled by this.  So we use our crucial opening scene to establish that Lincoln wants to help black soldiers. Wow, profound stuff here. Talk about beginning your movie with a bang.

Lincoln then heads back to chat with his wife (more characters talking in rooms) who expresses disappointment that he’s so set on passing the 13th Amendment. Now I may have this wrong (again, you have to realize how dense this script was) but the central conflict of the story seems to be that Lincoln has already freed the slaves during the war.  However, he’s afraid that once the war is over, the democrats are going to say he abused his war powers and therefore reverse the ruling. For this reason, Lincoln wants to make it official, and he feels he’ll have an easier time if he can get the amendment passed now as opposed to after the war.

As it stands, all the republicans in the house are going to vote for the Amendment. But with the democrats outweighing the republicans in the House, Lincoln’s still going to need over a dozen democrat votes to pass the bill. Getting democrats to vote for the 13th isn’t going to be easy, with most of them fearful of the repercussions of going against their party. So Lincoln starts telling his Cabinet to offer the democrats jobs to convert them. I’m not kidding you. This is the rollicking story we get. Men in rooms trying to convince other men in rooms to vote their way by bribing them with jobs.

There are some semi-relevant things going on in the war (which we never see – why would we? That might be interesting!) but none of it was very clear or compelling. Or maybe it was clear and I just didn’t find it compelling. I’m trying to give the script the benefit of the doubt and hope that I missed something because I’d hate to think that this is all that’s going on here – 70 scenes of lobbying. The script even ends with a huge 20 minute sequence where we watch almost every single person in the house say “yay” or “nay” to the bill. Good lord, someone shoot me now.

Look, I’m not downplaying the importance of Lincoln’s achievements. But there are so many ways to dramatize events like these so that they’re actually entertaining and this script didn’t do any of them. Its slow redundant action-less narrative felt like it was daring you to hate it, as if by doing so, you weren’t  appreciating one of the most important moments in American history.   I’m not saying it had to be Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter. I’m saying give us SOMETHING compelling to watch.  A central battle that would have immense implications on the bill.  Anything other than men talking. And talking. And talking!

There’s an old screenwriting saying that goes, “Show, don’t tell,” and everything about this script did the opposite. It’s ALL telling and NO showing. Every scene is important men wearing silly wigs having boring conversations in small rooms. Everyone’s telling everyone else what to do and why to do it and what they feel. There’s very little subtext here. You have the “good” guys on this side and the “bad” guys on that side and that’s that. And the monologues. Oh God, the monologues. There were a million of them. I had monologue-fatique by page 60.

Lincoln even relies heavily on the dreaded “dual-line dialogue.” This is a signature of a screenwriter who’s a) just starting or b) doesn’t write many screenplays. Because the longer a screenwriter’s around, the more he/she realizes how incredibly unpleasant dual-line dialogue is to read. And that goes double for a script like this, which is already struggling to keep our attention. You’re telling me that I not only have to read ONE endless chunk of dense exposition theme-laden dialogue, but TWO? And I don’t get any further down the page by doing so??

The funny thing is, the script does follow the GSU model pretty closely. You have the goal (get the 13th Amendment passed), the stakes (if you fail, slavery might be reinstated), and urgency (they had to do it by the end of the war, which was coming up soon). But what was different about this goal than say, the goal in Zero Dark 30, was that THE REASON for killing Bin Laden was so damn clear. Here, the goal’s a little vague. Lincoln has already freed the slaves. Now he thinks MAYBE that MIGHT be overturned when the war is over? But he’s not sure?  So he’s going to double down? It just all seemed a bit uncertain to me and if the goal isn’t imperative, if it isn’t 100% necessary, the sakes suffer, and so does the audience’s interest.  And then of course there was the issue of 70 straight scenes with characters in rooms talking.  That didn’t do Lincoln any favors.

If there’s one good thing to say here it’s that Kusher’s script got Daniel Day-Lewis on board. I think writers forget how important this is. Getting the star you want (or the actor who’s going to make your project a go) is one of the hardest things to do in show-business and that’s because the best actors have the best material, which means the competition is fierce. That’s actually what happened here. Spielberg wrote a draft of Lincoln that Day-Lewis turned down! So it’s a major achievement to write the draft that the big actor says yes to. But whatever Day-Lewis saw in this part didn’t transfer to the rest of the story. Again, history geeks are going to have orgasms over this. But people who like watching good movies are not. Tony Kushner seems to be an incredibly accomplished and talented man. But I don’t think screenwriting is the best venue for his talents.

[x] what the hell did I just read?
[ ] wasn’t for me
[ ] worth the read
[ ] impressive
[ ] genius

What I Learned: Monologues are a toughie. Story-wise, they’re script killers, because they often slow the script down to a crawl. However, actors LOVE monologues. And that has to be factored in. So here’s how I would play it if I were you. If you’re writing to get your foot in the door, don’t have more than two monologues in your script. Producers want fast scripts and two monologues is usually the maximum you can get away with (this number, however,  will vary depending on the particular story and the writer’s ability to write dialogue.  Tarantino or Woody Allen, for example, can get a way with a lot more monologues than, say, David Guggenheim). Now if you’re getting your script to a big ACTOR, you can add another monologue or two for that character. This actually happens a lot. When a producer/writer team are about to send a script to a big actor, they do a pass beefing up the part to make it more interesting. I have no idea why Daniel Day-Lewis turned down Spielberg’s draft but accepted Kushner’s, but I have a sneaking suspicion all those monologues played a part.

  • Poe_Serling

    “Four score and seven years ago…’

    For obvious reasons Mr. Lincoln has been a staple of cinema from the very beginning… The character was featured in the silent epic Birth of the Nation (1915) and is still going strong with his latest incarnation in Spielberg’s Lincoln.

    Two of my favorite Lincoln films:

    Abraham Lincoln (1930) starring the great Walter Huston… the father of John Huston… the father of Danny Huston and Anjelica Huston. ‘…regarded as one of the definitive films on Lincoln.’

    Young Mr. Lincoln (1939) starring Henry Fonda and directed by John Ford. ‘In 2003, it was selected for preservation in the United States National Film Registry by the Library of Congress as being “culturally, historically, or aesthetically significant.’

    And the latest Lincoln with Daniel Day-Lewis and co. is definitely on my must-see list for 2013.

    • Marija ZombiGirl

      What about Abraham Lincoln : Vampire Hunter ?
      Ok, ok, I know the way out ;-)

      • Poe_Serling

        No… wait!

        I’ve already professed my unbridled enthusiasm for AB: Vampire Hunter. In fact, I was this close *-* to adding it to my above list.

        Why I decided not to?

        Because I felt this was going to be the ‘dead serious’ discussion of Lincoln films and their virtues… so, in a moment of poor judgment, I relegated AB: Vampire Hunter to a future post when Carson mentions the fun/silly side of the 16th president. ;-)

    • garrett_h

      Don’t forget Jack Huston, of Boardwalk Empire fame, in the Huston cinematic lineage! He’s absolutely terrific as Richard Harrow (my favorite character on the show) and I can’t help but see great success in his career as he goes forward. Even his Guiness commercial is riveting lol.

      • Poe_Serling

        Hey G-

        You’re right… the Huston talent tree has a lot of branches. To be honest, I wasn’t familiar Jack Huston or his body of work.

        After checking his credits, I did discover that I’ve seen his film Outlander with Jim Caviezel.

  • DD

    Loved this movie. Haven’t read the script, but I imagine it’s pretty boring. The performances are across the board spectacular (with the exception of Sally Field, who kind of miscast.) The movie starts slow, but it just builds and builds to this very satisfying climax (even though we all know how it ends!) If you are into history and/or politics, it’s a great movie. If not, probably a snooze. My parents hated the shit out of it.

    • Kay Bryen

      See, that’s just the thing: I *am* a history buff and a politics freak, yet it took me half a week to finish this monstrosity. Swear to God, it felt longer than the Civil War itself :-(

      • DD

        I can believe it. Trust though, see the movie. One of the best of the year (and I saw pretty much everything.)

  • Kay Bryen

    The paradox is, on one hand Day-Lewis absolutely deserves the Oscar — it’s truly terrifying how real he resurrected Abe. On the other hand, this was easily one of the worst films I’ve watched all year. (And I watched Breaking Dawn: Part 2)

    What I learned: Outstanding director + outstanding actor + outstanding writer does not necessarily make an outstanding film. Who knew?

    Spielberg really let me down because I always considered myself one of those cine-snobs who don’t need splosions. But here, I would have given anything just to see a wig accidentally catch on a candle flame or SOMETHING!

    • sbbn

      Why would you watch Breaking Dawn (any part)?? You watch movies like that and they only make more of them!

      • Kay Bryen

        Haha, I wasn’t feeding the monster, sbbn — as it was the last in the series anyway. But long story short: the only reason I watched it is I realized to my horror that my sci-fi script apparently has many similarities with Stephenie Meyer’s upcoming 2013 movie, The Host. So I grudgingly decided to see what other similarities we share as writers. (Thankfully none)

        • sbbn

          Sorry – I was just teasing and didn’t mean to make you feel like you had to defend yourself :) As a guy I really just… don’t get the whole twilight thing. Sparkly, stalker, vampires… And Stephanie Meyers just annoys me but that’s a whole ‘nother story.

          • Marija ZombiGirl

            Even as a woman, I don’t get it…

          • Malibo Jackk

            (Women like bad boys.)

          • Marija ZombiGirl

            Bad boys who… Gasp ! read Twilight ? :-)

          • Bella_Lugossi

            Twilight (I read the first one) is more about being a good guy, I think. A gentleman with fangs?

          • Malibo Jackk

            I think that why they invented fiction.

  • TGivens

    Well…at least there are no vampires. Thanks for that.

  • carsonreeves1

    I hear what you’re saying. It’s a different ballgame with A-list writer-directors because the rules are all different with them. But that’s kind of why I like analyzing them. They get to play around more without getting called on it, and I like to see where those chances take them. Sometimes to good places and other times to bad. Either way, we can still learn something from them.

  • Citizen M

    I haven’t read the script, but I have read Time magazine of November 5. They have devoted FOURTEEN PAGES to the movie, interviews, Lincoln bios etc. Okay, that includes three full-page images — Lincoln as Lincoln, Day-Lewis as Lincoln, and Spielberg as Spielberg — but still, how much free publicity can they dish out and still claim journalistic integrity.

    I think one of the problems for Lincoln biographers is that all the interesting bits of his life have been mined out. That leaves only the boring bits to have fresh insights into, hence all the back-room wheeling and dealing rather than dramatic action.

  • Malibo Jackk

    There’s a famous story about Sergio Leone –
    Sitting alone at a table at the Can Film Festival. (Why sitting alone? Maybe this story will help.) A man stops by to say hello. Sergio says he has this script (Once Upon A Time In America.) ‘Oh. What’s it about?’ says the man. ‘Sit.’ says Sergio. Then he proceeds to describe — every single scene in his 300+ script.

    Have always thought there’s a price to be paid for genius. (Don’t believe me — look at Einstein’s hair.)

    It’s the reason I write trashy screenplays.

    • Citizen M

      It’s 322 pages, but in a weird format and each scene starts on a new page. It may be under 200 pages in conventional format. Sample page:

      SCENE 6
      POLICE STATION. (1933) Interior. Night.

      There’s a little sign on the
      desk next to the phone;
      SERGEANT HALLORAN, it says.
      THE PHONE RINGS
      insistently.
      A hand reaches for it; we see
      the stripes on the sleeve.

      Suddenly, silence.

      • Malibo Jackk

        Needs a Carson review.

      • Poe_Serling

        Looks like Leone may have invented the screenwriting technique action stacking.

        • g-blatt

          Leone didn’t invent that format. My understanding is that that’s just how scripts are (were) written in Italy.

          • Poe_Serling

            Thanks for the info, g-blatt… I kinda had a hunch it might be something like that.

    • Poe_Serling

      Great story.

  • Bella_Lugossi

    GSU check, but not enough stuff happening. Too many people talking in rooms.

    I’m wondering, Carson, did you enjoy 12 Angry Men?

    And what if you want/need your movie to be talky, indoors and ‘boring’? Any tips on ‘doing it right’? Things to avoid?

    I like the tip about monologues. Insightful bit of info: the fact that monologues are added to please the stars. Never knew that, but it makes a lot of sense.

    I also liked the “actors/stars alwas have the best material to choose from”-bit. Makes sense, but I never fully realised this. Of all the millions of people who are writing screenplays, only the best few make it into the hands of A-listers.

    Maybe it’s time for me to write a monologue-heavy period piece in which Tom Cruise orates for hours at an end. Anything to get Tom that oscar.

    • garrett_h

      12 Angry Men is a masterpiece. And there’s a couple fundamental differences it has with Lincoln.

      1. The stakes and urgency are, dare I say, higher. There is a man on trial to possibly be put to death (or given life in prison) and these 12 individuals with their 12 opinions and 12 sets of ideals and 12 biases and prejudices have to come to a consensus in a matter of hours. I haven’t seen Lincoln yet, but from what everyone is saying, things seem a little vague. Slavery is abolished, but not really? He’s the President, but it only kind of worked, but not completely? So he has to go back in and do it again? I dunno…

      2. We know the outcome of Lincoln. We don’t know the outcome of 12 Angry Men. That keeps us on the edge of our seats. Sure, we knew the outcome of Apollo 13 too. And I’m still scratching my head trying to figure out how they got that one to work so well. But the mystery in 12 Angry Men is so much more compelling because we have no idea how it ends. We even start forming our own opinions as to whether we think the guy did it or not. And these 12 guys all see it differently too. Whereas in Lincoln, it’s slavery, and I’d say 99% of the audience is already against slavery, not forming opinions of its pros and cons. And you only have Democrats vs. Republicans (two sides for conflict, not twelve), and we already know the ending.

      • Poe_Serling

        ‘…. the mystery in 12 Angry Men is so much more compelling because we have no idea how it ends. We even start forming our own opinions as to whether we think the guy did it or not. And these 12 guys all see it differently too.’

        Well said… and so true. 12 Angry Men is a 5-star classic. Plus, it boasts a who’s who of cinema’s top character actors – Martin Balsalm. Lee J. Cobb, Jack Warden, E.G. Marshall, Jack Klugman, etc. and starring Young Mr. Lincoln himself – Henry Fonda.

        • Malibo Jackk

          Quick story about Fonda –
          When Fonda came on set, he looked out the window
          and his insecurities crept in — ‘I can’t do this. I can’t do it.’
          The director asked why. ‘The trees aren’t real.’ Fonda said.
          ‘Don’t worry,’ the director said, ‘No one will know.’

      • dw

        “I haven’t seen Lincoln yet, but from what everyone is saying, things seem a little vague” – what an absurd comment. Yes, we know the outcome of Lincoln. We also know the outcome of most movies we go see (superhero will save the day, man and woman who hated each otherfall in love, etc.) Lincoln is all about the process of it all, and the brilliant balancing act and legal maneuvering that was required to pull it off.

      • Citizen M

        WE know the outcome of Apollo 13, but did the guys in the capsule? Or the guys in the control centre? The skill of the screenwriter is putting us there beside the participants so we forget we’re in a cinema and we feel we are with the astronauts and engineers, experiencing what they experienced.

        I’m up to p. 64 of Lincoln, and I have not experienced any of the tension and anxiety that they must have felt in Washington in those days. It’s all move and counter-move, an intellectual exercise, not an emotional one.

  • ripleyy

    Scripts like these are difficult because – on paper – they’re dialogue-heavy and boring but on screen they work. Now, I haven’t seen Lincoln and I plan not to because it’s not my thing (despite being a history buff myself) but there seems to be an amount of these scripts that work when everything works together but not when you read it.

  • Citizen M

    Lincoln in a cabinet meeting, p. 26: “Now here’s where it gets truly slippery. I use the law allowing for the seizure of property in a war knowing it applies only to the property of governments and citizens of belligerent nations. But the South ain’t a nation, that’s why I can’t negotiate with ’em. So if in fact the Negroes are property according to law, have I the right to take the rebels’ property from ‘em, if I insist they’re rebels only, and not citizens of a belligerent country? And slipperier still: I maintain it ain’t our actual Southern states in rebellion, but only the rebels living in those states, the laws of which states remain in force. The laws of which states remain in force. That means, that since it’s states’ laws that determine whether Negroes can be sold as slaves, as property – the Federal government doesn’t have a say in that, least not yet – (a glance at Seward, then:) – then Negroes in those states are slaves, hence property, hence my war powers allow me to confiscate ‘em as such. So I confiscated ‘em. But if I’m a respecter of states’ laws, how then can I legally free ‘em with my Proclamation, as I done, unless I’m cancelling states’ laws? I felt the war demanded it; my oath demanded it; I felt right with myself; and I hoped it was legal to do it, I’m hoping still.”

    OMFG. This isn’t a movie, this is a thesis. My head is spinning trying to parse what he’s saying. I think the movies are the wrong medium for this type of thing. You need time to appreciate the nuances, like days and weeks of time, not a couple of hours.

    • dw

      this is nuts. absolutely nuts. this is one of the best scenes in the entire movie. Lincoln isn’t meant to be an action movie. It’s more like a courtroom one, and a very effective one.

    • http://twitter.com/cjGiltner C.J. Giltner

      I thought this was actually a great way of spelling out the stakes and Lincoln’s own self doubt for the average viewer.

  • Sanket

    The movie was certainly boring as hell. First twenty minutes predicted that, rest of it solidly proved it.

  • MelanieWyvern

    I have never agreed with a SS review as much as I do with this one. Lincoln was numbingly boring — as if the creators went out of their way to make the film as tedious as possible.

    It’s a movie for people who watch those Sunday-morning Meet-the-Press-type shows and find them riveting. Yet ironically, even those programs are more compelling, because at least in the case of the issues they discuss, we don’t yet know how they’ll turn out.

    Look, we all know what kind of movie Lincoln is. It’s political Church — that is, it’s the modern-day equivalent of the experience that past generations had getting dragged to Church on Sunday to endure a dull sermon, because it was supposed to be “good for you.”

    This film is the same thing. It’s a secular sermon. Lincoln is one of those figures who has been made into a secular saint, in the modern political religion that largely functions for many people today the way that religion did for people in past generations — prescribing a set of values that are supposed to be correct.

    Spielberg’s Lincoln is the modern version of the old Lives of the Saints tales that religious folk used to get crammed down their throat. And it’s just as dull and tediously pious.

    By contrast, a film like Gone with the Wind tells the Civil War story from the Southern point of view. The difference is, it makes it compelling and exciting and emotionally involving. Even many people who aren’t predisposed to sympathize with the South are caught up in its narrative brilliance.

    • New_E

      Actually – and surprisingly given the potential for full-on cloying sentimentality this had from the start given that this is a serious Spielberg movie about one of America’s most beloved president – this didn’t really come off as a hagiography to me and that may be its greatest strength. They succeeded in making Lincoln human – or at least, as human as a romanticized construct of a historical figure could be.

      In fact, I think they went too far in the opposite direction and created a Lincoln prone to grand pronouncements, but pretty much self-effacing and without much affect otherwise.

      As for the lives of thesaint, they’re not always “dull and tediou

      • MelanieWyvern

        I think conservatives learned long ago that boycotts not only don’t work, but only fabricate faux-controversy that sells tickets. In fact, I’d half believe that Kushner went out of his way to create scenes especially humiliating to Southerners expressly to attract some easy controversy “news,” only to come away disappointed when the general reaction to this film was “boring” rather than “controversially offensive.”

        Many Hollywood filmmakers still think of themselves as edgy students fighting against stuffy old Dean WASPs. But there are few old Deans left, so they keep beating the bushes, trying to find some last cultural conservative, somewhere, to offend. It’s a pretty pathetic way to make onself feel like a “rebel”, when the “rebels” are the establishment.

  • the monster

    The scene at the beginning in which black Union soldiers recite the Gettysburg Address to Lincoln ( or was that the Emancipation proclamation) portended this was going to be Spielberg’s slant on history, not a realistic depiction.

    It was painfully earnest, overly contrived and amended by a white soldier quoting Lincoln as well.

    Mark Kermode of the BBC said Steven Spielberg was at his best when making films he didn’t see as socially important and he’s right. Overly didactic films like “Amistad” and “Lincoln” show a respect for the black suffering in America but ironically cause the suffering of audiences who actually came to the movie theatre to have a good time and not be lectured to by a man whose sensibilities are that of a fourteen year old boy.

    As the Star Wars prequels proved there’s nothing deadlier to a films momentum than showing legislation on the screen, especially when depicting historical legislation we know passed.

    And those who said Daniel Day Lewis gave a great rendition of the president must be about 170 years old because no one is alive who can vouch for that authenticity, not even Doris Kearns Goodwin, the writer of “Team of Rivals”. I found Lewis’s thin reedy voice incongruent with Lincoln’s appearance and his self satisfied smile rather smug.

    The whole movie had a smugness about it in fact, with John Williams music thumping you over the head, trying to numb you into submission to feel things the screenplay couldn’t. Spielberg is a cinematic bully now, trying desperately to convince you you’re watching something important, while throwing the dumb masses a crumb by showing James Spader and his cohorts shenanigans in trying to sway the Democrats.

    Lincoln’s son, Josh Gordon Levitt was abandoned just like Tom Cruise’s was in “War of the World”s.

    It was a slog. Scenes weren’t dramatized. History couldn’t have been as boring as this film. If it was Lincoln would’ve put the gun to his own head in Ford Theatre and pulled the trigger himself.

    • New_E

      Agreed about the soldiers – black and white – reciting to Lincoln in the beginning. What was that all about? So… strange.

      E

      • Thunk24

        Great review Mr Monster. I got to about page thirty and then those endless monologues lost me. Doesn’t mean I won’t go and see it – I’d watch Daniel Day Lewis read a phone book. And didn’t Aaron Sorkin do this kind of thing all the time in West Wing? Mind you there was always a sense of urgency in West wing and the stakes were pretty clearly defined.

  • garrett_h

    This review doesn’t surprise me at all. Based on the trailers, reviews, etc., this one looked like a talking heads pic. I’m sure it’s a terrific film (perfomances, set/costume design, etc.) but as a screenplay I’m not surprised its lackluster.

    I haven’t seen Lincoln yet. I WANT to see it. I’m a huge history buff. I WILL see it. Just not in the theater. I see no reason to spend $12 to drive to a movie theater and watch what is essentially a play on the big screen when I can watch it in the comfort of my own home for $1 in a matter of months.

    I saw the Kings Speech in theaters. Rushed out, even. One of the first in line. And I was so disappointed. It was a terrific film, I just don’t know why it was in movie theaters and not on stage. That’s when I learned my lesson.

    Maybe I’m going the wrong way? I’m getting older, but the movies I tend to see in theaters nowadays are the action flicks, super hero flicks… big, spectacle films. Shit you gotta see on a giant, 50-foot, nausea inducing screen, rather than the 50-inch LCD or Plasma at home.

    The lone exception is Awards’ Season. Sometimes the buzz gets so great I’ll drag myself out of the house just to see the film before the shows air. But that’s getting less frequent too.

    I guess I just want more bang for my buck.

    • Jarrett_H

      No wonder you didn’t wanna go see The Artist with me, but lobbied for Transformers when it came out. SMH.

      As a counterpoint to this, and mainly Carson’s review(which admittedly I only skimmed), I did like what Chris Terrio said in his recent article on Vulture about The Toughest Scene I Had to Write:

      “One of the more common critiques of a screenplay one is likely to hear in Hollywood is that a script has “too many men in rooms talking” (which always strikes me as bizarre, since roughly two thirds of The Godfather consists of men in rooms talking.)”

      Off to see Django now!

      • carsonreeves1

        Men in rooms talking can work if the stakes are always high and there’s either lots of conflict, lots of dramatic irony, or both in the scenes. I felt that here in spurts, but never in any prolonged capacity.

  • shewrites

    I didn’t read the script but I saw the movie. I found it riveting. The performances by Daniel Day Lewis and Tommy Lee Jones to only name those two made it a slow burning and satisfying drama.
    I can see how the script could look drab and boring. The movie is anything but.

  • New_E

    I totally agree with the review. Saw the film the other day and I just sat there wondering when something would finally happen. Tony Kushner should have kept it as a play. That’s what the film felt like.

    Other aspects of the film were odd as well – from the indifferent cinematography to the lighting to the overall direction. It felt so opaque, just couldn’t get into it. I’m pretty much open-minded and patient when it comes
    to film, but this did try my patience. Too much grand speechifying.

    It is possible to make filmed plays exciting – see 12 ANGRY MEN. Purely political films can be exciting as well – see t Otto Preminger’s ADVISE AND CONSENT or even MR. DEEDS GOES TO WASHINGTON. This film just flatlined though and as usual with Spielberg, this had a bit of the sentimental and sanctimonious,,b to

  • fragglewriter

    I hate monologues so I only have one in my script. I hate hearing monologues because it slows down the movie and its just too long. If they would last 10 seconds or less than maybe

  • carsonreeves1

    I love it. Moderation Proclamation! (you should be able to post w/o being moderated now)

    • Poe_Serling

      Carson just tapped into his inner Lincoln… on the flip side of things, wonder if Lincoln would enjoy a double-double and a side order of animal-style fries for lunch.

      • Michael

        Yum.

  • carsonreeves1

    I always say if you’re going to break rules, it’s best to break them where they accentuate your strengths. Sorkin is just such a better dialogue writer than this guy, it’s ridiculous. So he’s able to get away with some things lots of other writers wouldn’t be. Also, there’s a ton of conflict in all the scenes in The Social Network. That wasn’t the case here.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Danny-Gordon/10615440 Danny Gordon

      That’s a strong point. But it also makes me curious who did the lion’s share of dialogue in Munich? Script is credited to Kushner and Eric Roth. My guess is the dialogue was mostly Tony’s (Roth’s dialogue in previous efforts has never struck me as anything but conversational and informative). And, if we can believe that Tony is responsible for the dialogue in Munich, I would say he’s an exceptional dialogue writer. There are endless examples of witty, observant, poignant, sophisticated dialogue in that script (imo, the script as a whole is masterful). I’m actually seeing Lincoln today, so I’m curious to see how all this lines up in my mind.

  • MelanieWyvern

    Seriously.

    And the sad this is, the film is going to rake in a boatload of Oscars and other awards, not because it has any artistic/aesthetic merit (because even its defenders know that it’s a limp work), but mostly because people will feel that it’s their political obligation to vote for it.

    It says the “correct” things, hates the “right” people, delivers the most “appropriate” messages, etc. It is, in every way, a product of our times; more’s the pity.

    It’s just like, if there were a Christian film awards, they’d always vote for the preachiest movies.

    • http://twitter.com/dillwashere The Dill

      If there were Christian film awards I’m sure Kirk Cameron would have a Lifetime achievement award by now.

      • MelanieWyvern

        I’m no Christian, and from what little I’ve seen of them, I can’t stand Christian movies. Too preachy. (But then, so is Lincoln, just for a different ideology — cultural Marxism.)

        At the same time, I admire the fact that the Christians have tried to create a separate film industry outside the stranglehold of Hollywood and its Hollywoodist values. I just don’t think the Christian alternative is much preferable.

  • Writer451

    I assumed this film was going to show how Lincoln was a badass leader b/c he was able to deal with the war and slavery while also handling a crazy wife and son. Unfortunately, that was not the case.

    In the movie, his crazy family had pretty much no impact on his role as president. His wife throws a tantrum and that’s it. It doesn’t affect his decisions or his ability to do his job. All of a sudden his son has a breakdown and Lincoln slugs him and that’s it, it doesn’t impact his decision to bomb whatever port that was. The dysfunctional family scenes are so isolated that they might as well not even be there. Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t one of the things that made THE FIGHTER so entertaining was seeing how the protagonist’s dysfunctional family gets in the way of his goals?

    Second, there’s no conflict for the audience. We’re not made to feel uncomfortable by the war, so what does it matter to us if they prolong the war just a little more in order to achieve the 13th amendment? If Spielberg had opened with a war scene so gruesome that we dreaded seeing another war scene and then hints in the dialogue that another even bigger war scene is coming up unless peace is achieved, perhaps we would feel as conflicted as the characters about whether or not we want peace or abolition. In my opinion, that’s more entertaining than characterizing the pro-peace legislators as biggots and slowly working to a predictable ending.

    Also, the movie is titled LINCOLN. Why then was so much time spent on James Spader and the Tammany Hall guys? If the movie is about Lincoln, then shouldn’t we see them and their efforts through Lincoln’s eyes, not our own 3rd person omniscient eyes?

    • Citizen M

      “There’s no such thing as a great screenplay. Because they are not meant to be read. There are just great movies.” — John Gregory Dunne (A Star is Born, True Confessions etc.)

      That seems to be the case here. A lot of people are saying the movie is great. The script, not so much.

  • Bella_Lugossi

    Glengarry Glen Ross. Fireworks.

    I typed a big fat piece, which, diqustingly, was eaten by the spider. But I learned something, so I’ll share just that.

    If you put people in a room for 90% of the time, the character work, backstory, dialog and everything else good you want in your character has to be really strong. If your two mains gals need to be eating donuts, walking down some stairs – trip, bump into an unfriendly old lady with her gnarly dog, then maybe, just maybe, what they were saying to each other was really that interesting or relevant.

    So I thought: that’s a nice benchmark. If I have people talking and thing don’t work, from now on, I will just transport them to the most boring room in the world, see what they really have to say without all the distractions.

    The other thing is this: writing a good “INT. BORING ROOM – ANYTIME movie” may be the greatest challenge there is for a screenwriter. I never thought about writing one untill today. So cheers for that to Carson and all the fine users on here.

    P.S: I really need to stop pressing backspace. Disqus not like.

  • AS

    The script was definely dense with monologues. I agree with most of the comments. I wanted to be drawn in but most of reasons why I normally like Kushner’s work just didn’t translate well here. Playwright, great…Screenwriter, not there for me.

  • ZachSternwood

    Carson, da man! The SS Pull-No-Punches zone! Who has the stones to stand up to the Kushner/Spielberg juggernaut? CR does! U will likely never have lunch with either now, but I hear neither does In-N-Out anyway.

  • ZachSternwood

    David Guggenheim’s too savvy to fall into the monologue trap but if he wanted to, he’d write a good one. Check out his “you need 300s” dialogue for Denzel in “Safe House” when he was being waterboarded.

  • carsonreeves1

    Again, all those movies have TONS of conflict/dramatic irony/subtext. That’s how you do it if you want to go the “men talking in rooms route.” I just don’t think Lincoln had much if any of that, which is why those scripts worked but this one didn’t. Respectfully my opinion! :)

  • Davidcwalker

    Carson, I usually only comment when I disagree with your review (usually somewhat vehemently), but this time I couldn’t agree with you more! Hopefully this is a good sign that you’re finally coming around! Thanks!

    • carsonreeves1

      haha. good!

  • http://www.kevin-sharp.com/ K_Sharp

    This is one of those two-headed beasts. Someone could go watch the movie & be swept away by DDL, many of the other actors, and the historical feel of the whole enterprise.

    But print it out as a script, minus the great performers delivering these words, and you’ve got some real problems… and over-earnestness wouldn’t even be in the top five.

    I haven’t yet seen a “real” review of the movie that addresses this contradiction in any depth.

  • http://twitter.com/wereviking Warren Hately

    This is one of the things people love and hate about Carson, that he comes across (sorry mate) as an uneducated reactionary reader with a 6-year-old’s attention frame. From an overseas perspective this is an unfair stereotype many people have of Americans in general. Yet this is also the country and industry we screenwriters aretrying to not only break into, but appeal to — and as unpleasant and uneducated as it might make me appear, Carson’s comments about the appeal of this screenplay (as a screenplay) ring loud and true. There’s been a few films this year that I know I want to see, but actually watching them was a slow and boring experience (thinking of J Edgar and Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy). As a hater of musicals I am also likely to put Les Mis in there, as it looks awesome, with incredible sets, costumes and attention to detail and the chance to watch straight-acting Hugh jackman indulge his deeply gay love of musical theatre would probably also be pretty entertaining. But these films, like the description of the Lincoln screenplay, do need a bit more a pulse rather than authenticity. In most cases these projects are only incubated by the love of powerful producer-directors. Carson’s reactionary reading is a sobering reminder of just how hard the gatekeepers are to get past unless you’re one of the aforementioned power players. Kudos.

    • carsonreeves1

      I am quite reactionary. I totally admit that. But my attention span is easily closer to 9 year olds than a 6.

    • MelanieWyvern

      What a strange way to define “reactionary.” Basically, “anything not aggressively pushing a progressive agenda” is reactionary? So by implication, progressive propaganda is neutral, but a politically disinterested reading is “reactionary”? Bizarre.

      It’s the film being reviewed that’s politically slanted, not the review, which was aesthetic and politically neutral.

  • g-blatt

    The GSU are much stronger than you imply. Quick history lesson: The Emancipation Proclamation didn’t free all the slaves. It only freed them in the rebelling states (the one place Lincoln doesn’t have any authority), and left the 4 Slave holding states that were still in the union alone. So Lincoln had by no means “already freed the slaves,” If the war ends without that amendment slavery will still be perfectly legal in America. There’s no “maybe” or “might” about it. I thought the film made all of that perfectly clear, but maybe that’s just me bringing my own knowledge into the theater.

  • Spitgag

    I am always tempted to think Carson pans big A list director scripts/movies for his site’s PR purposes. Then I remember that he has his biases and it’s not like he ever hides them. Lincoln was ok, not great. Danial Day however is probably the best actor on the planet so there’s that. The man could star in a movie about a cactus growing and it might be amazing.

    Wonder what people here think of Django which I thought was f*ing AWESOME. Not so much the audience I shared it with tho. They came out of the theater like they’d survived a plane crash. If Lincoln wins best picture and Django doesn’t even get nominated, I will shake my head in disgust.

  • Will!

    I haven’t seen this flick yet but every opportunity that arise to view it has been late at night. Not ideal for a 2 1/2 historical drama.

    Not saying that in a bad way, but you need to be in a certain mindset.

  • dick

    What is dual line dialogue?

  • srdiction

    I want to see it just because Daniel Day-Lewis is in it. If an biopic can show a profound person as a real human being, it succeeded. 90 per cent of these movies are big and clunky. You have to admire a person depicted to love the movie.

  • JNave

    Disclaimer: I haven’t read the script or watched the movie. When I first saw the previews to Lincoln, I couldn’t imagine anyone wanting to watch it. It looked boring, one of those films where the dull dialogue and speeches are somehow enhanced by the dramatic background music. So I’ve been surprised to hear all the raves for it (not from critics; it’s never surprising to hear them rave about boring movies). I’m still not interested in seeing it and I can take some solace in this screenplay review (and some of the readers’ comments), even though I’m sure the movie is better. Maybe one day… but this review pretty much sums up my fears of sinking my time into this one.

  • MelanieWyvern

    As you can see from my post, I took it that you were applying the term “reactionary” not to the film, but to Carson’s review.

    However, if you intended the word “reactionary” in the way that you describe, then my comment doesn’t apply. I assumed that you were using “reactionary” per its well-known and most frequently used political definition, as a synonym for “conservative.”

  • http://atticofthefilmaddict.blogspot.com/ Matty

    I think this screenplay is amazing, as is the film. It found it enthralling and never boring. Yes, it’s a lot of talking in rooms, but it certainly isn’t the first film to do that. I won’t even list the others that do it, and they succeed because of subtext/dramatic irony/suspense under the surface, but so does Lincoln. It’s just more subtle, and you have to be really interested in politics and political drama to appreciate it. If I had to liken this script to another movie, I’d compare it to The Contender, which was entirely scenes of people in rooms talking, or people walking and talking, and political in nature as well. I think that’s an excellent film as well.

  • http://twitter.com/cjGiltner C.J. Giltner

    I take it from the comments there aren’t a lot of West Wing fans here. While it may have made for a slow read, it was far from boring. I guess the legislative process is more interesting to some than others.

    Someone compared this to the scene killing Senate in Star Wars which is absurd. The story here is Lincoln working to pass the 13th amendment. This is not the story of the civil war at large, in which a detour to Congress would perhaps kill story momentum.

    Good script. Great movie.

  • J.R. Kinnard

    Didn’t get a chance to read the script, but I really enjoyed the movie. I usually have problems with Spielberg movies, but he showed a remarkable amount of restraint. He actually waited until the last 5 minutes of the movie to make a devastating narrative choice. lol

    I think this movie is for political wonks, plain and simple. If you are a wonk (like I am), you will enjoy it. If you aren’t, you will find it mind numbingly dull. I’m fascinated by politics, even if it sometimes sickens me. Seeing a pivotal moment in history, and the intense political wrangling it took to make it happen, was exciting to me.

    I very much enjoyed the paradox that by ending the war TOO SOON, Lincoln would relinquish all of his political leverage to pass the amendment. He also had the time pressure of the impending new congressional term.

    From a screenwriting perspective, I think “Lincoln” delivered the goods on what it was trying to do. I think it’s sometimes hard to accept a script on its own terms. For instance, I might want to see more substance in the script for a Michael Bay film, but I should know I’m never going to get it. I could crucify that script for being shallow, or just try to evaluate it based on what it wants to be.

    This is why, before I do ANY writing or detailing, I try to figure out exactly what my script IS. Once I’ve done that, I try to remain true to that vision throughout the entire process. I think Lincoln accomplishes this, even if the vision bores most people to death. :-)

  • MelanieWyvern

    Whenever you find the word in any newspaper or in the media, it is invariably used according to its political definition.

  • dianuj

    Forget the screenplay… Daniel Day-Lewis is a God. I dare anyone to watch There will be Blood and Lincoln one after the other and no be blown away. Wow. It’s always overwhelming to see a master at work. Like watching 2006 Roger Federer. The infamous God-Mode he’d enter. That’s what Daniel is to acting.

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